R/C Naval Combat

Yeah, it suprised me too the first time. Even the Richelieu turned a little better.  It just happens slower.  heh.

Posted By Mike Butts on 11 Aug 2011 07:28 AM 
... fast gun has an insane pace

and the unlimited factor with pump design is crazy. I saw a couple of 60-80amp pumps that people had developed. Thats just crazy, were talking almost 1000w in a 12v setup!
....

It is called FAST Gun for a reason, but really the pace isn't that fast once you get used to whats going on. 

The pump thing is overrated at a sanctioned battle, Even ships with normal pumps take way more damage than they should, after a point you're just giving more points to the enemy.  Sinking with light/med damage doesnt hurt the team nearly as bad as taking a pounding and sinking with 100 belows. (within reason of course)  Teams have won NATS with more sinks but less damage.   True a lot of people take it as a big ego hit when they sink but that doesn't make it a good tactic while playing as part of a team. (Now if you only count sinks pump capacity becomes a lot more important to prevent such sillyness, but there are other potential problems with only counting sinks or making them worth a lot of points which the fast gun guys generally feel isnt worthwhile. ie some ships are easier to sink so they would get picked on, atleast by any fleet in need of points)  Who battles with a 60-80amp pump anyway?  Don't think we see that in battle, seen it on the bench but those are two different animals.   

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"Super Pumps" are very much like "Super Guns", ego driven....(which has a noticeble negative effect on the hobby as we see here.  Which is why I'm so against them and the bragging and boasting that goes along with them, doesn't help the hobby.)  Granted I like fiddling with guns in my basement as much as the next guy and I have a rather nice Chronograph setup so I can gather data.  But hey I'm an Engineer, thats what we do.

And no I don't put my hardest hitting guns in my boats, why? More effort than it's worth.  My guns already hit hard enough to do what I need them to do, so the extra effort to build other versions and install/maintain/feed them just isn't worth it.  The gun design and testing I do now is purely out of my desire to see how close I can get to the theortical limits.  Engineer remember...

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Personally, I pursue high capacity pumps not necessarily to keep the ship floating far longer than it should, but to keep the ship floating while MOVING to effectively stay in combat.

How many times has a captain with a 2 gpm pump taken enough damage that he has to stop and pump out before continuing the battle? Now take a captain with a 2.5 - 3 gpm pump that can keep battling effectively longer before having to stop or go on 5. I've seen this concept taken to extreme with two high capacity pumps in a single ship.

The idea is to remain in the battle and battle effectively until ammo is out or you need to run on your 5 minutes. That is when a high capacity pump pays dividends.
 

As for guns ... I totally agree that harder is not better ... after a certain point.  For me, that point is when the cannon's rate of fire starts to degrade. 
There is also the point that ships get damaged from BBs.  An example is the two BB hits the Erin took during the IRCWCC nats.  One BB hit below the penetrable window and went through the fiberglass layer and into the balsa wood below.  The second BB hit the bow hard area and went through 2 layers of fiberglass into the hardwood below.  That is too hard.

Posted By RichelieuBB on 10 Aug 2011 05:37 PM
A funny story about fast gun speeds ...

A WW2 fast battleship looks good moving at 24 sec/100ft. The bow wave and water movement is fairly realistic.

On the other hand, pre WW1 era ships in fast gun try to submerge at 28 seconds. The Verite PDN at 28 second speed is practically underwater. I can actually tell if the ship is on speed by how far the water travels back over the bow ... if the water starts sloshing against the front of A turret, then the ship is very close to 28 seconds. Heh.

Had to comment on this:  My first boat in the hobby (Fast Gun) was Von der Tann.  Unless I trimmed the boat slightly stern-heavy, then at it's allowed speed of 26 seconds, the "bow" wave was parting around the barbette of Anton turret!  Good thing I had a good deck seal!